Pale Moon has released version 25.0, which is a major update from version 24x.
It is important to note that Pale Moon 25.0 will not run on Windows XP. An exception is the specialized Atom build because of limited operating system availability on netbooks and the like. More details on the dedicated page for this change.
In addition to security updates, the list of changes is very long and can be found in the Pale Moon - Release Notes (http://www.palemoon.org/releasenotes.shtml).
I note one of the changes,
Quote•Disable Firefox Compatibility mode by default.
This means Pale Moon will no longer have a Firefox/xx.xx indicator in its UserAgent string.
I wonder if this means Pale Moon will have a chance to show up with it's own slice, instead of lumped in with "Other (http://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-market-share.aspx?qprid=2&qpcustomd=0)".
I think you're right, Bill. Since the (stupid, "Metro-style", take over the screen space with huge "tiles") MSN website update, Pale Moon is finally recognized as being an updated browser at MSN Weather (http://www.msn.com/en-us/weather). I like(d) that site because I could see the weather for family in other locations at a glance.
See this page for Known Incompatible Add-ons - Add-ons - Pale Moon (https://addons.palemoon.org/firefox/incompatible/). Note that although AdBlock Plus is shown as incompatible, it does indeed work. However, to edit the filters, it is necessary to open the Add-ons tab and click the icon to change options.
Good to know about Adblock Plus. Thanks for that.
For those stuck with Windows XP, via Moon Child on the Pale Moon (https://www.facebook.com/PaleMoonBrowser/posts/555097674526716) Facebook page,
QuoteWindows XP users may be happy to know about this fully endorsed version specifically for Windows XP! Both x86 and x64 supported.
Pale Moon for Windows XP - Software - Binary Outcast (http://binaryoutcast.com/software/projects/pm4xp/)
Although AdBlock Plus was continuing to block ads for me on Pale Moon version 25 (since I wasn't seeing ads on websites that I know have them) check this out:
Adblock Plus (Pseudo-Static) - Add-ons - Pale Moon (https://addons.palemoon.org/extensions/privacy-and-security/adblock-plus/)
QuoteAbout: This Pseudo-Static release provides users of Pale Moon a fully functional ABP experence while we work with the Adblock Plus team to get Pale Moon officially supported.
BEFORE YOU INSTALL PLEASE REMOVE THE MAIN-LINE VERSION AS THEY WILL CONFLICT
By: Adblock Plus Team (Modified by Pale Moon Add-ons Team)
Version: 2.4.6-pm
Compatible with Pale Moon 25.*
Download (https://addons.palemoon.org/media/addons/extension/pm-102/adblock_plus-2.6.4-pm.xpi)
Quote from: Corrine on October 10, 2014, 11:56:02 PM
Although AdBlock Plus was continuing to block ads for me on Pale Moon version 25 (since I wasn't seeing ads on websites that I know have them).......
Yes...It does work perfectly well for me, too.... :mitch:
Although I don't see its little icon on the browser, I don't think I will bother to update to version 2.4.6-pm....unless I hit a problem further down the line.
See Moon Child's explanation of Why do some extensions no longer work in v25? (https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=5932).
If you run into any websites that don't display correctly and show the "you're using an outdated browser" message, see instructions here by Moonchild on What to do when a website doesn't recognize Pale Moon (https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=6004).
Pale Moon: Release notes
Pale Moon 25.0.1 (2014-10-15)
This is a small update to address an important Jetpack extension compatibility issue and includes a number of security fixes.
•Update of the add-on SDK to add missing "Pale Moon" engine entries to lists. This should fix extension compatibility issues for jetpack extensions that otherwise already work with the new GUID.
•About box release notes link corrected
•Fix for VP9 decoder vulnerability security fix
•Fix for direct access to raw connection sockets in http security fix
•Fix for unsafe conversion to JSON of data through the alarm dom element security fix
•Update of NSS to 3.16.2.2-RTM security fix
Quote from: Corrine on October 10, 2014, 11:56:02 PM
Although AdBlock Plus was continuing to block ads for me on Pale Moon version 25 (since I wasn't seeing ads on websites that I know have them) check this out:
Adblock Plus (Pseudo-Static) - Add-ons - Pale Moon (https://addons.palemoon.org/extensions/privacy-and-security/adblock-plus/)
QuoteAbout: This Pseudo-Static release provides users of Pale Moon a fully functional ABP experence while we work with the Adblock Plus team to get Pale Moon officially supported.
BEFORE YOU INSTALL PLEASE REMOVE THE MAIN-LINE VERSION AS THEY WILL CONFLICT
By: Adblock Plus Team (Modified by Pale Moon Add-ons Team)
Version: 2.4.6-pm
Compatible with Pale Moon 25.*
Download (https://addons.palemoon.org/media/addons/extension/pm-102/adblock_plus-2.6.4-pm.xpi)
Curiosity finally got the better of me and I installed version 2.4.6-pm
It works fine and the little ABP icon is back... :mitch:
Okay, I'm confused. What do they mean by "MAIN-LINE VERSION"?
Quote from: Digerati on October 16, 2014, 05:22:13 PM
Okay, I'm confused. What do they mean by "MAIN-LINE VERSION"?
I was actually wandering about the same thing!
I just disabled it and removed it from the add-ons prior to installation. It worked fine.
Quote from: Digerati on October 16, 2014, 05:22:13 PM
Okay, I'm confused. What do they mean by "MAIN-LINE VERSION"?
Your current version of ABP, I would assume they want you to uninstall it (although it appears from Basil's comment that disabling it seems to be sufficient) so that there is no conflict with the older version.
The "main-line version" is the add-on installed from https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/adblock-plus/. It is then replaced with the Pale Moon add-on team modified version from https://addons.palemoon.org/extensions/privacy-and-security/adblock-plus/
Hmmm, then it seems saying "Firefox version" would make more sense - at least to me.
I note too if you open the Favorites drop down menu, it has listed a Mozilla Firefox folder with links to Firefox Help and Tutorials, Customize Firefox, Get Involved, and About Us with the last two going to Mozilla sites. It seems to me if you want to distinguish yourself from Mozilla Firefox, they should remove all those links back to Mozilla. I note PM its own help menu via the main PM drop down menu.
Are you referring to Pale Moon Bookmarks? If so, I suspect that is because you had a Mozilla Firefox folder on Firefox and imported bookmarks to Pale Moon. I had deleted that folder from Firefox long ago so have no such folder on Pale Moon.
Yes, PM Bookmarks but I did not import anything.
Quote from: Corrine on October 16, 2014, 07:39:11 PM
I had deleted that folder from Firefox long ago so have no such folder on Pale Moon.
Dito...
I'm still running Palemoon 24.7.2. Just to be clear, when I decide to update, first I should remove ABP, then update, then go here https://addons.palemoon.org/extensions/privacy-and-security/adblock-plus/
and install that addon?
Correct. Uninstall ABP and then install from the Pale Moon site.
BTW, it was questioned in the old topic at FL about the need to edit the useragent for sites displaying the "you're using an outdated browser" message (Didn't he say something about visiting 47 sites? Not sure if he had problems with any of them or was merely saying that is how many sites he goes to regularly). I haven't had that problem since the update to 25.0
Quote from: Corrine on October 18, 2014, 01:51:03 AM
Correct. Uninstall ABP and then install from the Pale Moon site.
BTW, it was questioned in the old topic at FL about the need to edit the useragent for sites displaying the "you're using an outdated browser" message (Didn't he say something about visiting 47 sites? Not sure if he had problems with any of them or was merely saying that is how many sites he goes to regularly). I haven't had that problem since the update to 25.0
I got the impression that he found 47 sites with a problem.
I also got the impression that it happened before any of the "tweaks" were discussed.
Well I haven't gotten any notices about using an outdated browser with PM 24.7.2 yet. In fact, neither has my husband who uses PM 24 daily on his netbook.
I will update PM. Right now I'm "fixing" FF 31ESR that I've finally installed and updated to replace the portable version I was testing to see if I could tweak it to my liking. Once that's fixed, then it's on to PM.
Then when I get PM updated and squared away, I get to do the same thing on 3 other computers! (My husband & I have both desktops and netbooks that we launch browsers on so the browser has to work properly).
Quote from: Pete! on October 18, 2014, 02:24:45 PM
I also got the impression that it happened before any of the "tweaks" were discussed.
You're right, Pete. I checked the recycle bin and found the reply when I asked:
Quote
Quote from: CorrineHow many websites have you found that don't recognize Pale Moon?
47
Since the discussion is removed from there, I cannot ask for examples or find out what OS, etc.
Quote from: Corrine on October 18, 2014, 04:00:59 PM
Quote from: Pete! on October 18, 2014, 02:24:45 PM
I also got the impression that it happened before any of the "tweaks" were discussed.
You're right, Pete. I checked the recycle bin and found the reply when I asked:
Quote
Quote from: CorrineHow many websites have you found that don't recognize Pale Moon?
47
Since the discussion is removed from there, I cannot ask for examples or find out what OS, etc.
The person I suspect of being "SmileyFace" is using Windows 7 (32 bit).
He gave me some examples.
I'm glad I checked a couple of them before I posted them.
I'm not sure if he's serious, or being mischievous.
I don't have PaleMoon installed, so I can't verify.
They're not the kind of sites I'd feel comfortable posting on a forum where I didn't want to be banned.
I could send you a PM, but I won't expose you to that unless you ask me to.
Thanks, Pete. I had the feeling there was something "off" about him. Based on your comments, I'll pass on the examples
.
Notes from reading the Compatibility Reports for v25 (http://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=6144) thread:
From what I understand being posted by Moonchild and Tobin in the Compatibility Reports thread, the jetpack update to version 25.0.1 has resulted in the increased ability to be able to fix add-ons based on the jetpack style. For example (http://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=5883&start=90#p38466):
QuotePrivacy Badger as well as Fastest Search and Self Destructing Cookies are jetpack style add-ons that fail in PM25 because of a very specific edge case that we have found a solution in the codebase to fix these and maybe a few others (time will tell) the fix as well as some additional security updates will be in Pale Moon 25.0.1.
While most add-ons that are broken will not be fixed by this.. it does reduce the incompatibilities to a degree and of course with the psuedo-static project going any add-on we don't have to convert means we can spend time on the more stubborn ones that we do have to!
If you are interested in following the RSS feed as incompatible add-ons are either added to the "psuedo-static" project or linked to a "forked" version (re-direct to either the add-on developer or Firefox add-on page with version now compatible with Pale Moon), an RSS feed is available at https://addons.palemoon.org/feed (https://addons.palemoon.org/feed). The Pale Moon add-ons page is here: https://addons.palemoon.org/
Quote from: Corrine on October 18, 2014, 07:56:54 PM
Thanks, Pete. I had the feeling there was something "off" about him. Based on your comments, I'll pass on the examples.....
Turned out, he was trying to play a trick on me.
At this point, I'm not even sure I've got the real "Smileyface".
After deleting 9 posts by another member there who is very angry about the PM decision, it occurred to me to check the person's IP address. The poster with "47" problem sites is the same person registered with a different name.
Thanks for the heads up on this browser. I used to have it portable style on the desktop in a folder but it was recently trashed with the notorious DECRPT.TXT crapware that had me furious but humiliated at the same time. :sos:
At least I can get some fresh start moving ahead again with this new version too. Appreciate the tips on Adblock-plus :mitch:
Hello, Corrine and Forum! :mitch:
Something I have noticed after updating Pale Moon. The Google page looks like it comes from an old version of Firefox or Internet Explorer. The appearance is not the same when I open it with IE. Please, look at the attachments. Additionally, when I search for an image (write in google bar a word, e.g. flower) the search options are the same they were years ago. IE has no problem at all. So, I can say that PM looks like an old browser in front of IE. Why this happens?
You've lost me, Panos. I'm not seeing what the problem is.
Quote from: Corrine on October 19, 2014, 06:39:09 PM
You've lost me, Panos. I'm not seeing what the problem is.
Sorry, Corrine!!!! :lol:
Well.. What I mean is that the appearance of google page is different after the update. It was look like this months ago. Recently, google page in Pale Moon was just like it is now in IE (please see the attachments in the previous post).
Also... When I search for an image (write a word in google bar and then choose images), the page I get is different from IE's and also different from what it was before the update. Only a small amount of images in every page. Please, try it. Search for an image in IE and in Pale Moon to see what I mean. It looks like I use an older version of Firefox or IE.
I know that perhaps I am saying nonsense but something is changed for sure! :smash:
Pure speculation:
Remember when some webmasters used a browser detector and showed you a different page if you had Netscape than if you had IE?
For instance... As I recall, one of them couldn't handle iframes.
If I boot up my old Win 98 computer with FF 2.0.0.20, and open Google, I see a different page than I see with Win 8.1 and FF 33.0.
Since this version of PaleMoon is "different"....
Is it possible that Google doesn't recognize it (yet), and shows the old page by default?
Forget what I posted. I forgot I updated Palemoon on the computer I'm currently on.
That is not Palemoon 24, it is 25.
When I head here https://www.whatismybrowser.com/
it correctly identifies my browser as Palemoon 25 on Win 7.
So, Pete, some sites are recognizing it correctly.
All browsers and websites should conform to the W3 standards (http://www.w3.org/standards/) so all webpages look exactly the same, regardless the browser used. And that makes sense. Why should the developer be required to develop, and then maintain different pages for different browsers? That would be a huge waste of resources and would potentially lock out some potential customers.
This happened before when almost the entire world conformed to IE6 proprietary standards to take advantage of IE6 features. It locked out many FF and Netscape users. So starting with IE7, even MS started making IE use industry standard protocols.
Quote from: Digerati on October 19, 2014, 09:16:56 PM
All browsers and websites should conform to the W3 standards (http://www.w3.org/standards/) so all webpages look exactly the same, regardless the browser used. And that makes sense. Why should the developer be required to develop, and then maintain different pages for different browsers? That would be a huge waste of resources and would potentially lock out some potential customers.
This happened before when almost the entire world conformed to IE6 proprietary standards to take advantage of IE6 features. It locked out many FF and Netscape users. So starting with IE7, even MS started making IE use industry standard protocols.
When I made my last post, I was looking at Google in the two browsers at the same time.
FF 2.x and FF 33 were actually showing me slightly different pages.
Similarly, DR M's attachments, were not identical...
One of the reasons I felt overdue for a newer OS, was an increasing number of websites, I couldn't use.
"Noscript" was more than a security measure, I saved me from innumerable "script timeout" notices.
If Google wants to take over the world, it might make sense for them to also cater to "update challenged" troglodytes.
Just wondering/speculating ..... If Google didn't recognize a browser, would it default to the simplest version of the page?
Bill, it isn't anything to do with developing website pages for different browsers. Rather, it is websites recognizing and accepting different browsers. Pale Moon is no longer based on Firefox ESD 24. It now has its own GUID.
Pete, I think Panos is too young to remember Netscape. :D
Now I understand what you meant, Panos. I always use Bing (and never search from the address bar), and the display is the same whether I use Pale Moon 25, Firefox 33 or IE 11. Actually going to Google images with Pale Moon, I see a difference there. If you elect to use Pale Moon, the only solution until Google catches up is as explained in What to do when a website doesn't recognize Pale Moon (https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=6004).
The instructions are customized for Google below. If you're going to copy/paste, it would be best to open a new Window instead of tab so you can go back and forth between the config page and here.
- Open a new Pale Moon window and type about:config
- Right-click on the page that opens and select New > String
- Type (or copy/paste) the following to create a Google preference value: general.useragent.override.google.com
- You will be prompted for the value, which is what will essentially tell Google to see PaleMoon as Firefox. This is where a new window will come in handy so you can toggle back here and copy the following to paste into the value:
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:25.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/24.9 PaleMoon/25.0
- Close the about:config page and test Google.
Quote from: Corrine on October 20, 2014, 12:13:03 AM
Pete, I think Panos is too young to remember Netscape. :D
I'm not too young to remember Netscape. :wink:
For many years it was all I used. I miss the little Netscape icon.
Who told you that I don't remember Netscape???? I just don't know what it is!!! :laughing:
Anyway! Corrine, I followed your instructions above. Nothing changed. Then I thought to change general.useragent.override.google.com to general.useragent.override.google.com.cy. It worked. Now, my google page and everything that is linked to it (images etc.) is fine.
Question: This trick makes Pale Moon pretend that it is Firefox? How I will realize that finally Google recognizes Pale Moon? Do we know that this will happen one day?
Thank you! :rose:
As I find sites that do not display in PM 25, but do in FF, I'll post here
http://www.hbo.com/ (page stays black) in FF, I get a spinning whitish wheel and then the schedule appears.
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6200
Change in approach for Pale Moon web identification:
the users have spoken, and Pale Moon has listened...
the problem of websites not using current-day capabilities detection methods and falling for "assuming capabilities based on an arbitrary ID string" is more widespread than anticipated.... so [effective with the next "point release", Pale Moon] will change the approach for a default installation of Pale Moon to include the "Firefox Compatibility" mode flag as enabled again (with a simple checkbox in Options to switch it off and on).
Although not something Moonchild prefers to do, the problem should be solved in the next release: Change in approach for Pale Moon web identification (https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6200):
QuoteOne of the impacting changes in v25.0 of Pale Moon has been the removal of the "Firefox" portion from Pale Moon's user agent.
Although this is generally considered in the developer and power user circles to be the right thing to do, because of the inherent problems attached to "lying about which browser you are", the problem of websites not using current-day capabilities detection methods and falling for "assuming capabilities based on an arbitrary ID string" is more widespread than anticipated. This includes big sites like Google, Apple's iCloud, Netflix, internal company sites, banking sites and even embedded web administration pages in routers :!:
This is one of the points where the interests of the general audience and the desired direction of software developers clash - and I will personally continue to work in the intended mode (non-compatible) with a small handful of workarounds on a domain-by-domain basis for the few problematic sites I visit, but will change the approach for a default installation of Pale Moon to include the "Firefox Compatibility" mode flag as enabled again (with a simple checkbox in Options to switch it off and on).
Despite the desired development direction, the inconvenience caused for users is simply too great as well as the resistance of websites contacted, who, despite using 21st century web design techniques and layouts for display, are apparently not willing to abandon old, limited and often incorrect detection methods. Maybe another few years down the road this can be attempted again, hoping for progress in the area of website development, but for now: the users have spoken, and Pale Moon has listened.
Pale Moon 25.0.2 (2014-10-24)
This is a small update to address a number of teething problems with the new milestone release.
Fixes/changes:
•Added a "Firefox compatibility mode" selection in Options -> Advanced.
This mode is enabled by default (reluctantly so), because too many websites (including some very big players who, themselves, promote an Open Web...) still use very poor browser detection methods based on arbitrary User Agent string comparisons, not catering to alternative browsers, and the resulting user experience being poor (being presented with mobile site layouts, broken pages, or even being flat-out refused service because someone exercises freedom of choice for web browser used). This should alleviate most, if not all, issues with browser-discriminating websites.
•Improved active tab display on particularly dark personas.
People using "black" personas/lightweight themes should now have a lot less difficulty distinguishing the active tab.
•Disabled SSL 3.0 by default (to put a muzzle on the POODLE).
Please note that this may cause issues with some poorly configured web servers (usually ones with a hopelessly broken security setup that do not support TLS 1.2 or secure (re)negotiation of the protocol).
•Fixed add-on update issue (that was preventing update checking through addons.palemoon.org).
•Fixed the redundant redundancy in asking redundantly if the browser would be allowed to ask to install an extension when not on addons.mozilla.org.
•Fixed the internal UA-sniffing insanity that broke devtools in a few different and colorful ways.
I'm happy to report that I applied the update, went to the hbo site and all works well.
:thumbsup: to Moonchild for fixing this.
QuoteCorrine, I followed your instructions above. Nothing changed. Then I thought to change general.useragent.override.google.com to general.useragent.override.google.com.cy. It worked. Now, my google page and everything that is linked to it (images etc.) is fine.
Question: This trick makes Pale Moon pretend that it is Firefox? How I will realize that finally Google recognizes Pale Moon? Do we know that this will happen one day?
Hello!
As I mentioned, I followed Corrine's instructions, and my google page is ok. Is there something to be done to reverse that action, now, after the last update?
Personally, I unchecked the option Use Firefox Compatibility Mode. I don't want my browser pretenting that it is Firefox. I don't know if I am correct. I suppose that a new update will fix all issues?
No, you don't need to do anything to reverse that option. However, if you run into any other sites that are not displaying correction, I suggest you re-check the default option. Moonchild did not want to make the change but felt he had to because the Pale Moon User Agent string is not universally recognized, resulting in poor user experiences, including being presented with mobile site layouts, broken pages, or even being flat-out refused service.
Just came across this article explaining the PaleMoon versions.
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=6505